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Dilemma: Giving nutritional info? - Page 2

post #16 of 29

There is NO WAY, yo should let them have your recipes! Especially with pictures of your food, and such, already. I wouldn't let them have mine, it would be a deal breaker. 

 

And now I am squeamish, thinking of the canned apple pie filling. How hard it is to slice some apples, mix with with some sugar, cornstarch, cinnamon, and salt and cook in a crock pot for an hour or two? You don't even have to watch it! You can actually nuke it for 10 minutes, and eat it with vanilla wafers and vanilla ice cream. YUM! 

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post #17 of 29
Thread Starter 

Anna, haven't you ever watched Chopped?  Savory chefs don't bake unless it's bread pudding or pain perdu.  Otherwise known as French toast.  Some can even make pot du creme, otherwise known as pudding.  One person takes crushed chocolate cookies (store bought), puts it into the bottom of a 4oz plastic portion cup, makes whipped cream, adds mint extract and green food color, shaves some chocolate on it, and calls it "grasshopper pie".  

 

People buy the crap out of it.

 

Look, I can't make grill marks on a steak, I have no idea what chimichury sauce is, and it would take me all day to chop a 50 lb bag of onions and it would probably put me in the hospital, so the same mockery can be said about my lack of culinary skills!

post #18 of 29

No, I never have watched it, but I can cook. It just isn't hard to make fillings! You don't really have to do anything! Just "CHOP" measure, stir, simmer. Surely they can do that?? I'm not asking them to bake a cake!

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post #19 of 29

Personally I still wouldn't mind, unless they've given you a cause for concern then I would trust them.

As for the photos, I think that's pretty standard. The photographer or whoever contractually owns the copyright doesn't have to give you the images. They can if they're nice, but just because you made the cake doesn't mean you have own the picture that somebody else took with their camera and time etc. I've done shoots with publications and I can't use the images afterwards and they don't provide copies etc whilst others are more than happy to send you the images as long as you credit them/photographer.

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post #20 of 29

If you spent time, energy and money creating the recipes that made your business successful, it's anything but foolish to be afraid anyone else might get their hands on them.

 

The website owners probably created the tool only to make it simple for submitters to post the calories on their products. Unfortunately you don't know what happens after you input your recipe, maybe nothing, maybe someone copies your recipes and becomes a competitor or someone grabs a bunch of recipes and publishes a cookbook, or the business gets sold and the internal policy changes. It sounds like no one signed a NDA.

 

Fortunately, you are able to provide your own calorie calculations. This solves all issues for now and I would totally go that way. You don't have to change how you do business with the coop as long as they allow you to provide the numbers, heck it seems someone as to manually input them anyway if they allow you to.

post #21 of 29
My operation is what I consider to be small time. I've tried not to let my business become more than I can handle.....

BUT YOU WOULD HAVE TO PRY MY RECIPE OUT OF MY COLD DEAD HANDS. This may sound like its too much but I spent YEARS creating something my customers love I'm not giving it up. Not interested in doing a cookbook either and I've been asked. (Although I think it's great)

As others have said hopefully they let you just send a calorie count or some general info. There has to be a happy medium. Surely they can understand you not wanting to give up your recipe. Surely!
post #22 of 29
FromScratchSF you're not being unreasonable at all. It's one thing if you have generic recipes but a good, consistent, original scratch recipe is gold. Plus since there are no guidelines on how they plan to handle the recipes, it makes sense to be careful. Who knows if one year down the line they change management and the new guys decide to publish their Chefs' Best Recipes because they are so popular?

If there was so confidentiality agreement or something to say they would use the recipes for the data alone and keep it private then it wouldn't be much of a problem but the uncertainty is what raises concerns.
post #23 of 29

One of my clients had a similar situation. He was required to submit all his recipes to accommodate one of his accounts, a restaurant under new management. The nutrition software works by inputting all ingredients so I found substitutions that would keep the nutrition info intact but would not work if anyone followed the revised ingredients. I don't remember now the exact substitutions, but for instance, I subbed hi-gluten flour for cake flour, salt for baking soda, etc. My client was especially pleased that if anyone did tried to take his recipes, they would be rather surprised with their results.      

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post #24 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by MimiFix View Post

One of my clients had a similar situation. He was required to submit all his recipes to accommodate one of his accounts, a restaurant under new management. The nutrition software works by inputting all ingredients so I found substitutions that would keep the nutrition info intact but would not work if anyone followed the revised ingredients. I don't remember now the exact substitutions, but for instance, I subbed hi-gluten flour for cake flour, salt for baking soda, etc. My client was especially pleased that if anyone did tried to take his recipes, they would be rather surprised with their results.      

That is awesome!

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post #25 of 29

I have on of Buddy's cookbooks and I remember ready about a recipe notebook that contained all of the original recipes. However, many of the ingredients were incorrect. Like you had to know which recipe switched the amounts or used baking powder instead of baking soda. So that if was fine if someone got a hold of the book and thought they were making something amazing. I've thought about doing that but I would probably forget which ones I changed. 

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post #26 of 29
Thread Starter 

I have an update, in case anyone is interested... 

 

So their whole point is to make sure things are "accurate" and "correct", therefore I cannot calculate my own values for my base recipes and give it to them.  For some reason, they think I am incapable of calculating those things correct - almost like they think there are many different master lists of nutritional values and somehow their list is THE list.  

 

So this morning I hop on the system and start typing in "chocolate" into the field, just to see what pops up.  As I suspected, "chocolate cake, prepared from recipe, without frosting" pops up.  I type in "frosting" and it pops up.  Then I type in "cake" and I get "chocolate cake, angel food cake, sponge cake" etc.  HAHAHAHAHAHA  and you cannot add an ingredient to their list.

 

So here I've been stressing out on wanting to make sure my stuff is accurate because of some pig headed notion that I hate lying to customers - and they've uploaded a list that includes a ton of pre-packaged and prepared foods.  So if that's what the other chefs are using, then I guess I'll use it too.  Accuracy indeed.

 

So, I just posted a red velvet cake - although "red velvet" wasn't in the drop-down menu, I used "chocolate cake" since the ingredients are similar and since it's not going to be accurate unless I calculate the values myself, I figure, what difference does it make?  Then I used "frosting".  

 

We'll see if I actually sell any cake now!

 

I still feel a little dirty.

post #27 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by FromScratchSF View Post

I have an update, in case anyone is interested... 

 

So their whole point is to make sure things are "accurate" and "correct", therefore I cannot calculate my own values for my base recipes and give it to them.  For some reason, they think I am incapable of calculating those things correct - almost like they think there are many different master lists of nutritional values and somehow their list is THE list.  

 

So this morning I hop on the system and start typing in "chocolate" into the field, just to see what pops up.  As I suspected, "chocolate cake, prepared from recipe, without frosting" pops up.  I type in "frosting" and it pops up.  Then I type in "cake" and I get "chocolate cake, angel food cake, sponge cake" etc.  HAHAHAHAHAHA  and you cannot add an ingredient to their list.

 

So here I've been stressing out on wanting to make sure my stuff is accurate because of some pig headed notion that I hate lying to customers - and they've uploaded a list that includes a ton of pre-packaged and prepared foods.  So if that's what the other chefs are using, then I guess I'll use it too.  Accuracy indeed.

 

So, I just posted a red velvet cake - although "red velvet" wasn't in the drop-down menu, I used "chocolate cake" since the ingredients are similar and since it's not going to be accurate unless I calculate the values myself, I figure, what difference does it make?  Then I used "frosting".  

 

We'll see if I actually sell any cake now!

 

I still feel a little dirty.

 

 

Good Grief!  Just shaking my head :)

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post #28 of 29
That is absolutely incredible.
Beginners, be sure to parrot advice and get your post count up as fast as you can. After all, it's not what you know, it's what people THINK you know.
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Beginners, be sure to parrot advice and get your post count up as fast as you can. After all, it's not what you know, it's what people THINK you know.
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post #29 of 29
That's a common shortcut in these kinds of systems...if there are a lot of different ways to produce a specific dish and the nutritional info won't vary that much among the different recipes, the system will provide a few abstracted database entries (or just one) to correspond to the popular varieties. For example, there is probably only one entry for chicken parm.

I have a feeling they won't accept your own calculated nutritional info more for technical and financial reasons than a concern for accuracy. If they don't currently have the capability to allow calculated nutritional info as an option, they would need to pay their programmers to make this change in the system, and this change would probably need to be applied to all their customers.

The argument that they want to ensure the system is as accurate as possible sounds a lot better than saying they don't want to be bothered with the change or spend money on it. If you offered to pay for the cost of making the change to the system they would probably have a different response.
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