I Give Up

Business By nancylee61 Updated 28 Mar 2015 , 1:05pm by nancylee61

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enga Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 12:44am
post #61 of 143

Quote:

Originally Posted by AZCouture 

ROTFL!

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nancylee61 Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 12:50am
post #62 of 143

Quote:

Originally Posted by pastrypet 
 

Maybe you could take an art class that teaches color theory and what looks good with what.

I actually have a lot of art classes! I just ignore the color wheel, because I love every color!! I need to tame myself down when I get those colors in my hot little hand!

nancy

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MimiFix Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 2:37am
post #63 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by nancylee61 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MimiFix 
 

 

Good idea Kate. New York's CFL allows wholesale to restaurants so that would be a great market. Retail sales, however, are restricted to agricultural venues such as farmers' markets.

 

Nancy would only need to apply for the Home Processor permit for selling wholesale. But specialty cake sales to individuals are not allowed so she would need a commercial kitchen to be legal.

I actually have an agreement with a woman with a local kitchen to use it for baking - she does an entirely different market than I do, so I can sell legally. 

 

Nancy, your agreement with this local woman to use her kitchen does not extend to using her license, also. Every business that processes food must have their own license. To legally sell products you need an Article 20-C license.

 

If you are practicing and the finished cakes are not for sale, you can certainly use your home kitchen.

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denetteb Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 2:51am
post #64 of 143

AYou already have a job, your year at developing your cake business is causing you frustration, you admit having problems making and sticking with a business plan. You say you love to bake and decorate and you love bright colors and big fluffy piping. You love when people say they love your cakes and.that doesn't always happen with paying customers. Why continue with the business? Keep your day job, go back to baking as a hobby. Make small cakes you love and give them to people and causes you love. You get to make any design you like with no customer demands or frustration. You could even get involved with an organization like Icing Smiles, the kids would probably go nuts over your bright cakes.

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johnson6ofus Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 2:56am
post #65 of 143

I am one who "gave up" before I even started!

 

I LOVE to bake, LOVE to decorate, but just not good enough. Some have that talent, not me--- really. I did teach Wilton (pay sucks, BTW) but had lots of fun and bought more fun tools as a business expense.

 

I gave up "THE DREAM" (quaint little corner shop bakery) because of the horror stories and long hours posted here. THANK YOU!!!!! I am NOT a "quitter", but reality requires a reality check from "those who know". You ALL saved me a bunch of $$$ and sweat.

 

And because of my lack or artistic talent, I will readily admit, I knock off designs I see here. (NO worries,

don't sell, and I am NOT your competitor) :) There is no way I can do a design without a visual. I am one who would also "over" do and mess it up worse. 

 

 

 

 

This says welcome friends or something like that in Iranaian for a friend. Funky letter tappits made me crazy, buttercream wouldn't smooth out, etc. Wish I could post the CC "inspiration" photo, but that cake artist would probably have to shoot me. Maybe I am into parody???? Yummy cake though... :)

 

So to you "dream killers", "Rainbow haters", "unicorn hunters", "tough lovers" and "Oops forgot to sugar coat this..." people I say PLEASE help keep this "real" for people (newbies/ students/ lurkers/ explorers) on the business pages who really aren't really ready---- emotionally, business savy wise, artistic skill wise, management skill wise, bookkeeping challenged, etc. 

 

Sometimes the truth hurts. (Not fair to post if I don't bare my own butt and lack of talent...lol).

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johnson6ofus Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 3:02am
post #66 of 143

Found original cake here on CC by bubolinka posted 4/15/2013.

 

It is so awesome (hers, NOT mine).

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FrostedMoon Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 3:14am
post #67 of 143

OP, I'm all for taking a break to improve skills.  You have some time before you retire, which is perfect to give you time to hone your skills.  My business has been quite successful, but I wish I had waited a few years before I jumped in.  

 

When you are ready, you're in an awesome area to sell.  I went to Skidmore for undergrad and know there is tons of money in Saratoga, especially during the summer!  You just have to tap in to it.  Get properly legal and work on getting your name on lists for banquet halls and events halls around town.  This does not mean giving cake away, just getting your name out there.  Make a great wedding cake flier and get it out there too.  Lots of people get married there.  I'm not sure of the legal requirements, but see if you can sell cupcakes in the Skidmore dorms.  Offer online/email orders and you will get TONS of orders.  This was quite a while ago, but we used to have weekly floor meetings where dorm staff would take turns getting a snack to get people to come to meetings.  We would totally have ordered cupcakes on a regular basis!  Also, check if local towns have parent associations.  See if you can get your name out to them.  Maybe offer a SLIGHT discount for members.  If your cakes are really good, they will come back over and over.  

 

Good luck!

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FrostedMoon Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 3:32am
post #68 of 143

I apologize for the double post, but I'm not being allowed to edit my post.  I took a look at your website and I agree with AZ, with the exception of the wedding cakes, the cakes on your website look quite amateur.  I see the smooth icing on your yellow cake, but it's hard to notice through the crazy piping.  I know others have said this, but I agree that style is quite dated.  Not something I would order.  Same for the fondant work.  Bumpy, lumpy, and ragged edges just aren't professional.  I am sure you have come a long way, but if you want people to pay you good money for cakes, they need to look as good as they taste.  Doesn't matter if you are better than other bakeries at this time.  Is your goal to be a good cake artist or just better than the crappy bakeries around you?  I think you can do much more!

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enga Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 3:39am
post #69 of 143

Since we are being honest and baring our butts. Nancy this is my first tiered cake after a year of cake decorating. My instructor told me this while grading one of my cakes, "You know what your problem is Enga? Your failure to push your edit button." :lol:

 

But I kept practicing and I got better. If I never own a bakery or sell another cake, I'll never stop practicing and honing my skills.

 

HERE'S TO THE CAKE DECORATORS THAT DARED TO FOLLOW THEIR DREAMS!

 

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AZCouture Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 3:55am
post #70 of 143

A

Original message sent by johnson6ofus

I am one who "gave up" before I even started!

I LOVE to bake, LOVE to decorate, but just not good enough. Some have that talent, not me--- really. I did teach Wilton (pay sucks, BTW) but had lots of fun and bought more fun tools as a business expense.

I gave up "THE DREAM" (quaint little corner shop bakery) because of the horror stories and long hours posted here. THANK YOU!!!!! I am NOT a "quitter", but reality requires a reality check from "those who know". You ALL saved me a bunch of $$$ and sweat.

And because of my lack or artistic talent, I will readily admit, I knock off designs I see here. (NO worries, don't sell, and I am NOT your competitor) :) There is no way I can do a design without a visual. I am one who would also "over" do and mess it up worse. 

 [URL=http://cakecentral.com/content/type/61/id/3260450/] [/URL] This says welcome friends or something like that in Iranaian for a friend. Funky letter tappits made me crazy, buttercream wouldn't smooth out, etc. Wish I could post the CC "inspiration" photo, but that cake artist would probably have to shoot me. Maybe I am into parody???? Yummy cake though... :)

So to you "dream killers", "Rainbow haters", "unicorn hunters", "tough lovers" and "Oops forgot to sugar coat this..." people I say PLEASE help keep this "real" for people (newbies/ students/ lurkers/ explorers) on the business pages who really aren't really ready---- emotionally, business savy wise, artistic skill wise, management skill wise, bookkeeping challenged, etc. 

Sometimes the truth hurts. (Not fair to post if I don't bare my own butt and lack of talent...lol).

And for some reason, and I think it's just plain stubbornness, some people are just convinced the real talk is just people taking an opportunity to be mean or act high and mighty. It' laughable really. There's a point when following your dreams need to be matched with reality, I think for most people that realization occurs somewhere when adulthood kicks in, but that's obviously not everyone's experience. Can't make the rolling eye symbol with my phone, but anyways. ;)

Save for a few trolls here and there, that no one takes seriously anyways other than for a good laugh, there isn't anyone that posts regularly that doesn't have good intentions in their replies. It's such a simple concept to grasp. The better we all do...the better we [B]all do[/B]. If we're all only offering the best we can, when the time is right and the market supports it, there aren't any cheap cake ladies for those customers to run to when they think our quotes are too high. Good luck lady, [B]everyone[/B] is on the same page...you're going to find the same pricing wherever you go, because we [B]all[/B] did our homework and learned our value and decided not to put out anything less than our very best. And custom cakes are a luxury item, and no, none of us are here to be a bargain, or work for free. We listened to the costumeczars, the mimis, the decadent desserts, the snarky baker, the scp when they told us to [B]do our homework[/B] or we were in for a world of hurt. In a perfect world....

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mcaulir Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 5:06am
post #71 of 143

Two things.

 

I live in a town of 15 000 people. There are two bakers in town who make custom cakes - one opened a storefront, and seems to make most of her money selling cupcakes out of a cabinet, and lunches/catering/classes. I don't think she would make even one custom cake each week, just from FB pictures. The other works out of her home and maybe sells two per week.

 

I make custom cakes, but I wouldn't buy one. There's no way on earth I would spend $200 on a cake for a birthday of any quality, except for a wedding. I would buy a cheaper one if I didn't make them myself. Many people, especially in rural areas, just don't value having a custom cake. Which is fine. No matter how good your cakes, there are people who will just never spend that kind of money. You really need to find out whether there are enough people living near you who would be willing to buy a good custom cake for a fair price when you offer one.

 

Second, if a business isn't available on Google these days, and the website isn't user friendly, and have all the information I want on it, the business doesn't exist as far as I'm concerned. Your website isn't very user friendly, doesn't have much information, and the text isn't very well written.

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nannycook Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:24am
post #72 of 143

AHa ha ha, great photo!

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costumeczar Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 11:01am
post #73 of 143

A

Original message sent by johnson6ofus

I am one who "gave up" before I even started!

I LOVE to bake, LOVE to decorate, but just not good enough.

So to you "dream killers", "Rainbow haters", "unicorn hunters", "tough lovers" and "Oops forgot to sugar coat this..." people I say PLEASE help keep this "real" for people (newbies/ students/ lurkers/ explorers) on the business pages who really aren't really ready---- emotionally, business savy wise, artistic skill wise, management skill wise, bookkeeping challenged, etc. 

Thank you for posting this...i haven't been posting as I watched this thread, but I was wondering if anyone would point out that th main part of being ready to run a business isn't your artistic talent, ability to smooth out icing, blah blah blah. You can always hire someone to do that, and there will always be someone who's willing to buy a not-perfectly-smooth cake if the price is right. The point that matters most when you're starting a business is the business side of it, not the decorating side. The suggestions about marketing that are on this thread are more importqnt than the tips about practicing and "keep your chin up rah rah rah." You can be an awesome decorator and suck at the business side of it, and guess what business will fail as a result. You can also be a great business person and suck at the decorating, then go hire someone who's good at that, or practice until you get better.

The OP said that she's not going to start this business until she retires, and she plans on practicing more during that time. That's nice, but I'd suggest that you add in a class on business or bookkeeping or time management like johnson6ofus mentioed. Those are more important than the decorating in the long run. Look into the licensing like mimifix suggests, and look into the requirements for taking orders online or selling to the nearby college like frostedmoon mentioned. Find out what people in your area want to buy like MBalaska mentioned. Those are the type of tips that will help make a business successful. If you don't like any of that, or you can't stand thinking about marketing when you really just want to decorate, keep cakes as a hobby.

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nancylee61 Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 3:55pm
post #74 of 143

Hey, I appreciate what you all offered here, really. AZ Couture was shooting straight from the hip, and I admit, I was stung. I think Enga read that, and was kind. But I did get over it, and I do want to be excellent and not that "overpriced, kind of crappy baker" from the north.

 

Here is where I am at, after reflecting on all of your advice. I have learned a LOT from this thread, and I hope others did, also.

 

1. I know my cakes taste great, so that is good. Almost everyone who tries it says "this is the best cake I have ever tried." At my niece's $250 a plate dinner in NJ last week, no one could even eat the cake, it was foul. At her shower, the cake I made with the burlap, even the skinny girls were getting seconds and my SIL's mom had 4 pieces!!! (and she's skinny!!!)

 

2. My frosting is SMBC and it rocks, thanks to the recipe and considerable help from the ladies at cake central. 

 

Now for the bad:

 

1. I am an artist, I draw, paint, do pottery and make jewelry, but my flaw is I LOVE color!! You can never have too much color, but, yes, I can. I am going to study cakes that catch my eye, take notes. Think about it, rather than just put colors on, and maybe try to copy the colors in cakes I like. And, yes, the cakes at the White Flower Cake Shoppe are gorgeous because of their colors and design. I need that all-important "EDIT" button. 

 

2. Work on my pictures - where do you all take them if you are taking them at home?? I just sold my big house with a dining room, I really don't have a place to take pictures. Advice???

 

3. Do you generally fondant the cake boards? I have done that a few times, but usually cut the cake board and put the cake on a stand. 

 

4. Start thinking about a business plan. I have two years before I retire to get my cakes really sharp, and figure out a market. As I said, one place has the wedding market cornered and I didn't feel ready to do any wedding events this year. By next year, perhaps I can do some of those wedding things, it won't be a waste of $400 to $800. 

 

5. Focus for now on simple designs. The cakes on my website with fondant, they are older. I am much more careful now, and I hope they look better. I haven't been able to upload any recent cakes to the website for some strange reason.

 

6. I did take a course, very expensive, too expensive for what it was in my view, at CIA. That is where I learned the "dated" piping. I don't know if it is dated around here, or the teacher was just exposing us to all different styles, but I was putting into practice what I learned. Kind of like a monkey. I think I just need to keep practicing now, I have plenty of books and craftsy classes I haven't even finished watching yet.

 

7. Reiterating: I do need a business plan. I am a total absent-minded professor when it comes to business. That is if I decide to do this as a business. I like when people like my cakes, I like when they are appreciated and I don't know if I want the hassles that come with selling cakes.

 

I appreciate you all taking the time out to comment. I know you all helped more people than just me.

Nancy 

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-K8memphis Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 4:33pm
post #75 of 143

keep your color thing don't edit that out-- look at margaret braun and colette peters -- use all the colors you want all the time -- plow your own row --

 

and yes that's the beauty of doing cakes-- you can do one anytime-- finding people to pay for your highest flying creations made with supreme ingredients--few and far between-- lotsa compromise -- which is why working from home rocks -- which is why this being a second income rocks --

 

and as was said upthread by a wise person--try sculptures if you don't want to compete in the wedding world -- being able to balance a business on mostly sculptures another story -- 

 

i love your determination

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LoveMeSomeCake615 Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 5:26pm
post #76 of 143

Quote:

Originally Posted by AZCouture 

 If we're all only offering the best we can, when the time is right and the market supports it, there aren't any cheap cake ladies for those customers to run to when they think our quotes are too high. Good luck lady, everyone is on the same page...you're going to find the same pricing wherever you go, because we all did our homework and learned our value and decided not to put out anything less than our very best. And custom cakes are a luxury item, and no, none of us are here to be a bargain, or work for free.

This sounds like cake heaven!! Dare to dream! :D

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AZCouture Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 5:28pm
post #77 of 143

ACame across this today and thought of this thread.

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bilbo Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 5:39pm
post #79 of 143

Quote:

Fantastic article - no amount of sunshine, love, passion or rainbows can replace a business plan.

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enga Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 5:53pm
post #80 of 143

"I am an artist, I draw, paint, do pottery and make jewelry, but my flaw is I LOVE color!! You can never have too much color, but, yes, I can. I am going to study cakes that catch my eye, take notes. Think about it, rather than just put colors on, and maybe try to copy the colors in cakes I like. And, yes, the cakes at the White Flower Cake Shoppe are gorgeous because of their colors and design. I need that all-important "EDIT" button."

 

You have just described your niche! 

 

I never said the business aspect of cake decorating wasn't important. Its's important if you want to sell cakes. If that is truly what you want to do, then by all means, amour yourself with a good business plan, take small business and management classes. When you do you will have to answer a very important question. What do you want to sell and what will set it apart from other businesses? What is your niche?

 

I have done those things. Now I'm working on my niche, my canvas if you will, which is cake. I'm perfecting that canvas by improving my fondant and cake stacking skills.I have been experimenting with different recipes and techniques. Yes you can hire someone to do all these things for you but my passion is hands on cake deign. To be able to take a sketch on a piece of paper and bring it to life with my own hands. If and when I decide to sell cakes again, I want to create and design them.

 

Some people are passionate about making money, I'm passionate about creating art through cake. You can say "well that's why your business failed", and you would be right. I was catering to a market that did not appreciate my cakes, so I took a break and stopped selling cakes to reevaluate my situation. That is all I was asking Nancy to do. And no, offering her advice didn't cost me a dime. Last time I checked advice on this site was free. She, like anyone else can take it or leave it.

 

All of the material things that touch our lives were once someones vision or dream, they cant be achieved if you don't try to make to make them happen. No one said it was going to be easy. It's hard and takes a lot of hard work, determination, research and will power.

 

Good luck to you Nancy in all your future endeavors! And remember to never lose your childlike enthusiasm! ;-D

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MimiFix Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 5:57pm
post #81 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by bilbo 
 

Fantastic article - no amount of sunshine, love, passion or rainbows can replace a business plan.

 

Yes, great article, thank you AZ. My take-away: Competition is the key to how businesses do or do not survive. We've been touching on this a lot recently. 

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Seatac123 Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:28pm
post #83 of 143

Quote:

Originally Posted by nancylee61 

 

 and I do want to be excellent

 

 

What if you do not become excellent?

Can you still bake and decorate delicious cakes for fun?

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MimiFix Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:28pm
post #84 of 143

You're right, AZ. ;-D 

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MimiFix Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:32pm
post #85 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seatac123 
 

What if you do not become excellent? Can you still bake and decorate delicious cakes for fun?

 

Of course! And keep posting on CC, but in the other forums which can be way more fun than here in the Business forum!

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MBalaska Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:34pm
post #86 of 143

Quote:

 

Absolutely OUTSTANDING article that everyone needs to read !  Well Done AZ.

 

{of course Costumeczar wrote about this on her website recently, so she's ahead of the power curve in business matters)

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pastrypet Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:38pm
post #87 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis 
 

keep your color thing don't edit that out

 

<<snip>>

 

I do not agree. Keep all the garish colors and clashing combinations for your free cakes to friends and family, especially children, or just for yourself to practice. If you want to sell cakes, get out that color wheel and use the "edit button." I'm sure you've looked at pictures of hundreds of professionally done cakes and noted the color schemes.

 

I envy your pension and ability to retire at 55.

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-K8memphis Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:45pm
post #88 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis 
 

keep your color thing don't edit that out-- look atmargaret braun and colette peters -- use all the colors you want all the time -- plow your own row --

 

and yes that's the beauty of doing cakes-- you can do one anytime-- finding people to pay for your highest flying creations made with supreme ingredients--few and far between-- lotsa compromise -- which is why working from home rocks -- which is why this being a second income rocks --

 

and as was said upthread by a wise person--try sculptures if you don't want to compete in the wedding world -- being able to balance a business on mostly sculptures another story -- 

 

i love your determination

 

 

here's the gist of my quote -- you will be in very good company with big color

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FromScratchSF Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 6:50pm
post #89 of 143

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBalaska 
 

 

Absolutely OUTSTANDING article that everyone needs to read !  Well Done AZ.

 

{of course Costumeczar wrote about this on her website recently, so she's ahead of the power curve in business matters)

 

Agreed, this article rocks and anyone that is thinking "Hey!  I'm going to watch some ____________ videos and start selling cake and make truckloads of money!" needs to read it.  There are too many new bakers racing to the bottom to try and grab that last fleeting dollar. In 3, 5, 10 years from now the industry will look nothing like it does today, yesterday or 5 years ago.

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pastrypet Posted 9 Jul 2014 , 7:03pm
post #90 of 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by -K8memphis 
 

 

 

here's the gist of my quote -- you will be in very good company with big color

 

There's nothing wrong with big color. I love color. I do not regard Margaret Braun or Collette Peters as using garish and clashing colors unless it is appropriate, such as for an India-type wedding cake.

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