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The Knot Is At It AGAIN !!!

post #1 of 73
Thread Starter 
It just amazes me how The Knot, where many decorators advertise and where the site makes a practice of showcasing pricey cakes, is once again promoting myths about how to get a "cheap" cake.

http://yourmoney.msn.com/saving-money-help/fae1b7a5-2d19-4a73-897c-53bb6e78b124?from=en-us_msnhp#/saving-money-help/fae1b7a5-2d19-4a73-897c-53bb6e78b124

Rather than offer the simple advice to, "Know your budget and shop around until you find what you like AND CAN AFFORD.", they keep suggesting dummy cakes, adding other desserts (which I've found can often cost more per serving), kitchen cakes "cut in the back so no one will know" (still need to be filled, iced, etc.), using real flowers (some real flowers cost more than sugar, especially if they're exotic or out of season).

Sure, some of the ideas can cut about 20% off the high end, but really, why is it that they continually want to encourage brides to haggle with the cake decorators?

So help me, IF I had a contract with The Knot, I'd be demanding a refund !

Rae
I love you, but your emergency is not my crisis!

They say that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance.--Terry Pratchett (b.194
Reply
I love you, but your emergency is not my crisis!

They say that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance.--Terry Pratchett (b.194
Reply
post #2 of 73
Seems fair to me, the video advises brides to avoid intricate designs to keep the cost down, and get a smaller tiered cake with sheet cakes or a dessert table instead of a large tiered cake.

Sheet cakes will always be cheaper than tiered cakes because there is less labor involved, and they should taste just as good. Dessert tables can be set up so they are significantly cheaper than a tiered cake as well (of course they can also end up costing more, but if you want to save money you would obviously pick the less expensive options).

The only thing I don't agree with is the use of fake tiers to save money, probably since we charge the same per-serving cost whether the tier is made of Styrofoam or cake.
post #3 of 73
They're going to keep trotting out the same tired information for the rest of eternity.I'm not too worried about their advice, I just tell people what the real story is if they ask me about any of that.

I don't advertise with the Knot because it got me zero business when I tried it, because they gave me a really hard time when I cancelled, and because they pretty much let brides post whatever lies they want on their message boards. (Although I did just see a very satisfying review of a guy I don't like on there, which confirmed things that brides had told me about him.) I do know of one vendor who had a bride on the knot posting a fake story of what happened at her reception repeatedly for over a year, and the knot did nothing to stop it. Whenever anyone posted anything about this venue there she was, telling her fantasy story.

I've seen multiple brides post their version of events, and since I know the other vendors who were involved in the situations I know that their stories generally leave out the facts about what the bride's part in their fiascos were.
post #4 of 73
I just LOVE how you can't even leave comments.

I'm so sick of this stuff.

My sheet cakes aren't "cheaper". No, they aren't. They never will be.

I won't make fake cakes unless it's for a bridal show.

And I don't know about you, but "fon-DAUNT" costs the same amount of money weather I decide to wallpaper my house with it or put it on a cake. These people seriously piss me off telling people it's somehow "cheaper".

Real flowers are grown in human waist and sprayed in Agent Orange (practically). Yum yum!

I just LOVE how they didn't show a single "small perfectly decorate cake" in their montage, they only showed 3-4 tiered regular cakes. Because, you know, I LOVE telling people that when they want a sheet cake they are asking for a 10" display cake with a sheet cake for their 100 person wedding.

And this drives me nuts: It's pronounced "fon-DANT". Unless you are French or a French Ex-Pat. Then it's "fon-DON". There is NO hard T in French. JSYK, if you say "fon-DAUNT" because you think you are sounding cool and French, you are a dumb@ss. icon_biggrin.gif
post #5 of 73
Buddy Valastro (sp?) always says fon-DAUNT and it drives me up the wall!! icon_biggrin.gif
post #6 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by FromScratchSF

My sheet cakes aren't "cheaper". No, they aren't. They never will be.


Why not? Don't your sheet cakes (kitchen cakes) require less labor than multiple tier cakes, and therefore have a lower cost?
post #7 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by FromScratchSF

My sheet cakes aren't "cheaper". No, they aren't. They never will be.


Why not? Don't your sheet cakes (kitchen cakes) require less labor than multiple tier cakes, and therefore have a lower cost?



No. Making a 1/2 sheet still takes the same amount of ingredients. Same amount of time in the kitchen. Same equipment to mix/bake. Same insurance. Same hourly wage. Same amount of time to fill/ice. In fact, the boxes are much more expensive then the cardboard boxes I buy for $3 bucks and re-use for my tiered cakes, 1/2 sheet cake drums are way more expensive then the standard 16" cake drum and are harder to find, and I possibly have to rent extra storage in the walk-in to leave one or more cakes in there. I can't really stack them on top of each other, otherwise they'd be a tiered cake. Hardy har har. icon_biggrin.gif So no. Not cheaper, and never will be.

I am a high end baker - my 1/2 sheet party cakes are still 2 layers of cake, 1 filling, are at least 3" tall and retail starting at $210 (with NO decoration) and go up based on flavor and design. My kitchen cakes are still my standard 4.5" tall to match a regular tier and start at $6 per serving, just like my tiered cakes.

I am not Costco, so I really wish people would stop assuming we *all* are!
post #8 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by FromScratchSF

Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by FromScratchSF

My sheet cakes aren't "cheaper". No, they aren't. They never will be.


Why not? Don't your sheet cakes (kitchen cakes) require less labor than multiple tier cakes, and therefore have a lower cost?



No. Making a 1/2 sheet still takes the same amount of ingredients. Same amount of time in the kitchen. Same equipment to mix/bake. Same insurance. Same hourly wage. Same amount of time to fill/ice. In fact, the boxes are much more expensive then the cardboard boxes I buy for $3 bucks and re-use for my tiered cakes, 1/2 sheet cake drums are way more expensive then the standard 16" cake drum and are harder to find, and I possibly have to rent extra storage in the walk-in to leave one or more cakes in there. I can't really stack them on top of each other, otherwise they'd be a tiered cake. Hardy har har. icon_biggrin.gif So no. Not cheaper, and never will be.

I am a high end baker - my 1/2 sheet party cakes are still 2 layers of cake, 1 filling, are at least 3" tall and retail starting at $210 (with NO decoration) and go up based on flavor and design. My kitchen cakes are still my standard 4.5" tall to match a regular tier and start at $6 per serving, just like my tiered cakes.

I am not Costco, so I really wish people would stop assuming we *all* are!



Even if you don't decorate them you end up having more time to ice the stupid thing, too. Plus you could just be baking 4 or 5 larger tiers, instead of 4 or 5 smaller tiers plus the sheet cake, which ends up being an extra cake to deal with. Then you have to have a separate box for the sheet and more space to transport it. They stink. I just wrote a blog entry about something that happened to a cake friend of mine that was "less than optimal" about a sheet cake. I don't like doing them at all.
post #9 of 73
Interesting...I suppose it depends on how you have your processes set up and what types of cake you usually make. Since we target primarily mid-market customers instead of the premium segment, we mostly do single tier cakes (rounds and sheets) with an occasional multi-tier wedding cake every few weeks.

As a result we are optimized to produce those types of cakes, and we can put together a filled and decorated sheet cake in far less time than the equivalent number of servings of a multi-tier cake (not to mention kitchen cakes, which require even less time than a decorated cake).

Since we make a lot of sheet cakes we buy 100 packs of half sheet boards and boxes, they are relatively inexpensive. Other than the boxes and labor all other costs (ingredients and overhead) are similar.
post #10 of 73
If I do a decorated sheet cake it costs just as much as a wedding cake, because I don't do the "happy birthday" basic stuff. Sheet to go with the tiered cakes are usually unnecessary unless you have 250-300 servings or more, honestly. It would be the difference between a 14" or a 16" base tier, that kind of thing. Not too much of a difference in time when you're icing a 14 or 16" tier, but if you have to throw a sheet into that it's just extra time. It isn't that much extra, but it's enough to annoy me. Especially when you think "Oh good, I'm done...Agggh! Dammit! I still have to do that stupid sheet cake!" icon_evil.gif Not that that's ever happened to me.
post #11 of 73
For smaller weddings we often suggest a single tier round nicely decorated with fondant coupled with a sheet cake for the kitchen. This has the added benefit of allowing the customer to pick up the cake, since multi-tier cakes require delivery. I try to avoid deliveries whenever possible since it is a huge time sink.
post #12 of 73
Jason, all due respect, but the type of cake your former bakery makes and the types of cakes Kara and I make are not the same. Not in style, execution, or target market.

But interesting to know what bakeries that do specialize in sheet cakes sell to people. I'm speculating, but if your wife was more comfortable making tiered cakes, she wouldn't be suggesting a small birthday cake with a sheet cake for a wedding.
post #13 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by FromScratchSF

Jason, all due respect, but the type of cake your former bakery makes and the types of cakes Kara and I make are not the same. Not in style, execution, or target market.


Yep, that's why I said above that we target mid-market instead of premium customers.

Quote:
Quote:

But interesting to know what bakeries that do specialize in sheet cakes sell to people. I'm speculating, but if your wife was more comfortable making tiered cakes, she wouldn't be suggesting a small birthday cake with a sheet cake for a wedding.


It's not an issue of being comfortable making tiered cakes or not, with our process as it is we are more profitable making sheet cakes.

FYI the single tier cakes we make for weddings are not the same thing as "small birthday cakes", which tend to have very basic decorations and are BC only. You would do well to hide your derision a little better. icon_wink.gif
post #14 of 73
No, to be clear - a single tiered cake to me is a birthday cake. I could still work 6 or more hours decorating it, but it's still a birthday cake. Not a wedding cake.

Nothing personal, it's how I (and I'm sure a lot of wedding cake makers), feel.
post #15 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by FromScratchSF

No, to be clear - a single tiered cake to me is a birthday cake. I could still work 6 or more hours decorating it, but it's still a birthday cake. Not a wedding cake.


Well, I suppose we (and all our customers who have loved their single tier wedding cakes) will have to agree to disagree on that one. icon_smile.gif
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