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Will my state's new Cottage Laws put me out of business? - Page 5

post #61 of 79
[quote="kelleym"][quote="BakingIrene"]
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And baking wedding cakes while babysitting/changing diapers.


Yeah, this was really needlessly inflammatory. Just about every human being on earth has to defecate (hopefully) daily. We wash our hands, and continue with life.

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No, not really??? I for one, am SHOCKED!! Image

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Beginners, be sure to parrot advice and get your post count up as fast as you can. After all, it's not what you know, it's what people THINK you know.
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Beginners, be sure to parrot advice and get your post count up as fast as you can. After all, it's not what you know, it's what people THINK you know.
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post #62 of 79
The sheer volume of new cake companies coming onto the scene is where it can really hurt an established inspected shop.

In AZ in the last year over 1500 new legal bakers came onto the scene. The reach of a new baker used to be rather small, just close friends and family. Now over 51% of Americans have facebook accounts with an average friend count of 245. That's over 187,000 people that now have a "friend" that now makes cakes "professionally" in my state.

If you have a friend that lays tile professionally, are you going to spend your time researching tile companies, or are you going to call someone you already have a level of trust with? I will always give a friend the first chance at my biz and I would suspect that most people feel the same way.

A CFL can and will aid a lot of companies in closing their doors. Whether you are one of them or not may come down to how you position yourself in the market and how you operate your business.

Best of luck!
post #63 of 79
It still comes down to unequal business expenses. It has absolutely nothing to do with quality or a cheap cake.

Again, like in any debate or persuasion, the CFL advocates can find stats to prove a point but leave out those that do not support the cause. It's up to the other side to find that information.

Economically, it is not a level playing field no matter how you present it or argue it. It could have been, but instead, it was a case of, "Ask for as much as you can and see what you get". That is obvoius. Lawmakers don't have the time to devote to such a small portion of the business segment, so CFL passes because it makes them look good... a man for the little guy. Who cares about the now struggling very small segment of businesses that are adversely affected. The broader picture is that even though CFL will affect only a small number of those who actually take advantage, it just looks good politically without having to do anything. So few of the total population actually take advantage of it that all it did was make a once stable industry a sea of drowning businesses, not only suffering from an oversaturated market, but unable to survive because of unrealistic pricing.

The poster that likened this to a cleaning service is not getting the point. She chose to do business her way. But everyone in the cleaning business has the same rules and requirements to be in business: Pay your licenses and taxes. There are not two sets of rules and levels of investment for entry in that field.

And I haven't said this in a long time, but baking is not the one single option separating anyone from earning a living. There are plenty of jobs out there that do not require special licensing. Those who bake at home do it because they want to do it. Another job just isn't as fun. Well, that fun factor is a sad reason for hurting many people who have saved and sacrificed to own a baking business.
post #64 of 79
I just skipped page three so I went back and read it.

I have been in marketing in some form since the 1990's. The fittest survive model does not work in small home businesses. People will ignorantly sell under cost for years out of ignorance. We see this unrealistic pricing on CC every day. Proof.

I was never referring to myself as being adversely affected. My business will go big. I happen to be retired by the age of 45 and did not have to work. This business is for my high-achieving daughter. She will reap these bigger benefits, but we have set it up for her, just as we provided similar opportunities for our other children.

If you think those little businesses that don't pay taxes are not our business, you are very wrong. I will not state our tax level, but understand that it is high. Those of us who pay also pay the tax bill for all of those who don't. That is everyone's business. It is also an issue when taxes must be paid for license renewal. Where there is no license, no checks and balances on taxes.

When I refer to bakeries, I am correctly using the word for every baking business. The size is not relevant.

Another statistic you are obviously leaving out in your argument is the statistic on food illnesses in the baking industry in general. When my liability policy is under $400.00 for the whole year, that is a safe industry in general. Why didn't you include that instead of lumping CFL to the entire food industry? We pay malpractice and construction general liability in our other two businesses. No comparison.

And that cake you feel that you should bake should be baked. But for commercial purposes, it is unfair.

I would not have other feelings if CFL were available in my area. I am stating my case from an economic standpoint, not personal. But I have made CC friends with many people who have struggled to make their dream come true. This is what concerns me. But any case that makes an unlevel playing field is something that I oppose. Except affirmative action. I see that as a true correction of a past wrong. Not, "Nobody let me bake cakes".
post #65 of 79
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Originally Posted by kelleym

Join Food Democracy Now. Watch "Food, Inc." or "King Corn" or "FRESH the Movie" or "FARMAgeddon". Read a book by Joel Salatin. Google "FDA armed raid" to find out how the FDA is raiding dairy farmers' homes and farms to stop the sale of "dangerous" raw milk. (By the way, according to Texas DSHS, there has been 1 (one) sickness from raw milk in Texas in the last 20 years.) Read the book "Mad Sheep" by Linda Faillace about how the USDA destroyed her healthy sheep flock in the name of preventing "mad cow" disease. Google "Monsanto GMO" to find out about Round-Up Ready genetically modified seeds, and how Monsanto is wielding all its legislative muscle against having to label genetically modified products - they don't want you to know what you're eating. Oh, and how about the National Animal ID System (NAIS), where factory farms like Tyson can use one chip to "id" an entire warehouse of birds, but small farmers would have to tag every single bird? Did you hear about the farm-to-table picnic in Nevada where the Health Department showed up and poured bleach on all the food? You actually do have to seek out the information, because the mainstream media won't be feeding it to you (haha, punny!) on the 6:00 news. You might not call it a war. I do.




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GREAT to see citizens of the USA are also aware of these issues...its an international concern. I compare it to the power of Big Pharma in controlling health systems around the world. He who controls food, controls the world.

(Okay, so maybe a bit political, and off-topic to the OP, but seriously folks, this is an issue we all need to know more about!)

Life's too short to make cake pops.
___________________________________
www.sweetperfection.com.au

www.sweetperfectioncakes.blogspot.com.au/
www.facebook.com/sweetperfectioncakes (come visit sometime!)

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Life's too short to make cake pops.
___________________________________
www.sweetperfection.com.au

www.sweetperfectioncakes.blogspot.com.au/
www.facebook.com/sweetperfectioncakes (come visit sometime!)

Reply
post #66 of 79
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Originally Posted by scp1127

I just skipped page three so I went back and read it.

I have been in marketing in some form since the 1990's. The fittest survive model does not work in small home businesses. People will ignorantly sell under cost for years out of ignorance. We see this unrealistic pricing on CC every day. Proof.


I see the most "underpricing" posts from newbies who don't know any better, but I'm not sure how that's "proof".

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I was never referring to myself as being adversely affected. My business will go big. I happen to be retired by the age of 45 and did not have to work. This business is for my high-achieving daughter. She will reap these bigger benefits, but we have set it up for her, just as we provided similar opportunities for our other children.


Remarkable!

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If you think those little businesses that don't pay taxes are not our business, you are very wrong. I will not state our tax level, but understand that it is high.


I understand. I think even my dog understands by now.

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Another statistic you are obviously leaving out in your argument is the statistic on food illnesses in the baking industry in general. When my liability policy is under $400.00 for the whole year, that is a safe industry in general. Why didn't you include that instead of lumping CFL to the entire food industry? We pay malpractice and construction general liability in our other two businesses. No comparison.


Earlier you argued that food safety is ignored in cottage food operations (implying that they are unsafe), and now you argue that bakeries (you lump home and commercial bakeries together) are generally safe. Since home bakeries can also receive a liability policy for as little as $250 per year, I wonder what that means?

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I would not have other feelings if CFL were available in my area. I am stating my case from an economic standpoint, not personal. But I have made CC friends with many people who have struggled to make their dream come true. This is what concerns me.


I care about my friends, too. Many of them struggle, with their legal home bakery being the only thing that keeps their head above water.

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But any case that makes an unlevel playing field is something that I oppose. Except affirmative action. I see that as a true correction of a past wrong. Not, "Nobody let me bake cakes".


That's an interesting viewpoint, to say the least. Lots of food for thought! thumbs_up.gif
post #67 of 79
I used to be a full time high profile makeup artist. I've worked on movie sets, I've done makeup for celebrities.

A couple of years ago, thanks to YouTube, the
Makeup artistry became very popular. Every person who watched a how to makeup video on YouTube, decided they wanted to be a makeup artist.

This is very similar to the caking boom going on now.

Where I once made $4,000 a weekend doing makeup for weddings an high fashion events, I was losing some business because every chick that sold Mary Kay thoUght she was suddenly a makeup artist.
These things are always temporary and it comes with the territory of owning your own business.

If your work is exceptional and you are great at what you do, that will shine through, no matter the industry. Eventually those people who offer subpar and mediocre services will die out.

No matter your industry, you HAVE to plan for the downs, while you're experiencing an up. The mediocre and subpar will ALWAYS weed themselves out.

No his mind is not for rent, to any god or government...

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No his mind is not for rent, to any god or government...

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post #68 of 79
Not to keep up the debate with kelleym, but in my experience, people who underprice do it for a lifetime. They don't know any better and it's a way of life. It can bee seen in any cottage industry.

Please, if you are going to argue with me, get it straight. YOU compared CFL to the entire food industry in food illnesses. My other statement referred to a level playing field.

Please keep your rebuttals straight instead of working so hard to just state the opposite.
post #69 of 79
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Originally Posted by scp1127

Not to keep up the debate with kelleym, but in my experience, people who underprice do it for a lifetime. They don't know any better and it's a way of life. It can bee seen in any cottage industry.

Please, if you are going to argue with me, get it straight. YOU compared CFL to the entire food industry in food illnesses. My other statement referred to a level playing field.

Please keep your rebuttals straight instead of working so hard to just state the opposite.


My mistake, sometimes I have a hard time understanding exactly what you're going on about. Mea culpa. thumbs_up.gif
post #70 of 79
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Originally Posted by PieceofCakeAZ



A CFL can and will aid a lot of companies in closing their doors. Whether you are one of them or not may come down to how you position yourself in the market and how you operate your business.

Best of luck!



I can't say for certain that the new CFL in AZ is the main cause for this, but I just found out that 3 of our shop owning competitors are trying to sell their businesses on Craigslist. 2 of the businesses are pretty popular as well.

Another 2 long time storefront shops (open for over 20+ years each) have changed ownership in the last 8 months.

It doesn't seem coincidental.
post #71 of 79
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Originally Posted by Paperfishies

I used to be a full time high profile makeup artist. I've worked on movie sets, I've done makeup for celebrities.

.



names please, and were they nice to you? icon_biggrin.gif
post #72 of 79
Thread Starter 
Update from original poster---

The newest caker in town decided to jump the gun on the 25th and accepted a wedding cake order made in her home kitchen for last weekend.

3 tier Carrot Cake with Cream Cheese Frosting and real flowers for 150 people PLUS a 2 tiered Chocolate groom's cake with Ganache Icing. The bride called me first and turned down my $6.00/serving price. She then called the only other legal baker in town and turned down her $5.00/serving price.

I don't know what she ended up paying, but I know I can't make that much cake with premimum ingredients like cream cheese and ganache for any less than I quoted.
post #73 of 79
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Originally Posted by Amberwaves

I have a retail storefront that I open 3 days a week to sell baked goods like cupcakes, baked donuts and cookies. It is really convenient for me to bring the decorated cakes with me for people to pick up at the store.


I'm confused by this where are you bringing the cakes from? If you have a store front wouldn't the cakes already be at the store?

Also I am really curious what state you are in, my state is in the process of having a CFL and I know that the initial bill had some pretty hefty stuff that even home bakers would have to follow. Granted I haven't looked at the final bill but I can't imagine that they let all of this slide. So off the top of my head here is some of the stuff I remember from the original bill.
~NO other household chores while baking
~Must be inspected
~Must be licensed
~Must label made in a home bakery and list ingredients
~Recipes must be approved
~Have to have health card
~Separate storage for bakery items
~Must be insured
~No cream cheese icing
~No fresh fruit fillings

This is just a partial list and IMO takes out alot of the argument some of the PP have had about home bakers. I haven't looked at the final bill because if I decide to go the home baker route I am still at least a year away but I am excited that my state is making it a possibility.
post #74 of 79
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Originally Posted by Amberwaves

Update from original poster---

The newest caker in town decided to jump the gun on the 25th and accepted a wedding cake order made in her home kitchen for last weekend.

3 tier Carrot Cake with Cream Cheese Frosting and real flowers for 150 people PLUS a 2 tiered Chocolate groom's cake with Ganache Icing. The bride called me first and turned down my $6.00/serving price. She then called the only other legal baker in town and turned down her $5.00/serving price.

I don't know what she ended up paying, but I know I can't make that much cake with premimum ingredients like cream cheese and ganache for any less than I quoted.


So... when was this cake booked? It must have been months ago.

If the home baker in question took the order pre-CFL, then she's an illegal home baker, not a cottage food operator. So it seems like you would have the same problem with or without the cottage food law?
post #75 of 79
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Originally Posted by MrsBowtiy



Also I am really curious what state you are in, my state is in the process of having a CFL and I know that the initial bill had some pretty hefty stuff that even home bakers would have to follow.



We must be in the same state - WA. Reading all the previous posts helped me appreciate our new CFL. The regulations seemed crazy for such a low annual gross income (15K), but it does help to level the playing field a bit while providing a level of reassurance of food safety. The labeling, etc. is a pain, but after seeing a home recently with a shocking (to me) lack of hygiene, I appreciate requiring inspections. Our CFl is supposedly designed to help hobby bakers earn a very modest income, pay taxes, and find out what running a "real" business involves. The scary cheap, illegal Craigslist bakers (last one I saw featured photos of a pretty cake on a slab of plywood next to a paint can in her garage!) will always be in the picture. I hope the flood of newly licensed home bakers do not hurt our established bakeries; hopefully, bakeries really emphasize the products home bakers cannot produce. After a recent experience, I will only purchase from a licensed baker who has either been inspected or whose home I have seen.
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