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post #31 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by enchantedcreations

Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

I also think the article raises some good points, but those points could have been better organized and outlined more succinctly. For example, the issues of fan art and parody probably should have been covered in a few sentences instead of several paragraphs.



Well, you know what they say about hindsight.....


What does hindsight have to do with my comments?

Quote:
Quote:

I would also like to point out: If you are running a legal bakery, be it a store front or home front and you feel you ARE legal, then why get on a forum and be so shocked and dismayed over these situations? It should be a non-issue.


Knowledge of copyright law is less widespread than it should be among business owners, probably since it's not a hurdle you have to clear to get your business off the ground (like a health inspection might be in a non-CFL state). There's also the fact that infringement is so widespread, many will take refuge in the "everyone else is doing it" defense.
post #32 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorcake

So what exactly are the valid points that are raised?


There are several valid points, albeit many are buried in prose: the distinction between copyright and TM, unauthorized derivative work is unlawful unless it falls under fair use, wider distribution of your infringement increases your risk, how to deal with a client who asks for an infringing design, the discussion about licensed products, etc.
post #33 of 68
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by enchantedcreations

Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

I also think the article raises some good points, but those points could have been better organized and outlined more succinctly. For example, the issues of fan art and parody probably should have been covered in a few sentences instead of several paragraphs.



Well, you know what they say about hindsight.....

I would also like to point out: If you are running a legal bakery, be it a store front or home front and you feel you ARE legal, then why get on a forum and be so shocked and dismayed over these situations? It should be a non-issue.



Could you elaborate a little more on your last comment please? (shocked and dismayed)
I dream about cakes and stilettos!!
I dream about cakes and stilettos!!
post #34 of 68
Gatorcake, I meant no offense. Once again this thread, like many others has turned ugly. I only meant the auther "perhaps" had several points of view,take from it what you will. I like to keep an open mind when I come to Cake Central, I learn a lot from everyone here. I have no intention nor do I want to re-write that blog. I have enough on my plate. Thank you very much. I've been told over the years that I have a keen eye for seeing all sides of an arguement. That's all. Sometimes, if I feel strongly about something, I'll make a stand for that issue. But this is a mute point. Either your breaking the law or your not. BUT, people are still entitled to their opintion, just like you and I.

I merely suggested perhaps you keep a more opened mind. That's all.

It could have been written differently as Jason pointed out.......Everyone reads things differently.
Major life events require sugar.
Major life events require sugar.
post #35 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by enchantedcreations

Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

I also think the article raises some good points, but those points could have been better organized and outlined more succinctly. For example, the issues of fan art and parody probably should have been covered in a few sentences instead of several paragraphs.



Well, you know what they say about hindsight.....


What does hindsight have to do with my comments?
Not your comments, I was referring to the comment you made about the blog, it could have been written better. It's always easier to back and re-think or re-read, etc. what you could/ or should have said. It's a saying. Have you not heard it before?
Quote:
Quote:

I would also like to point out: If you are running a legal bakery, be it a store front or home front and you feel you ARE legal, then why get on a forum and be so shocked and dismayed over these situations? It should be a non-issue.


Knowledge of copyright law is less widespread than it should be among business owners, probably since it's not a hurdle you have to clear to get your business off the ground (like a health inspection might be in a non-CFL state). There's also the fact that infringement is so widespread, many will take refuge in the "everyone else is doing it" defense.

I think that's lam and I never let my kids get away with that excuse
Major life events require sugar.
Major life events require sugar.
post #36 of 68
I am not seeing where this thread turned ugly...?

I feel the article in question is not a good reference for cake makers because it was not written by a lawyer. Here is an article my attorney wrote on selling cakes made from copyrighted character pans. The moral of the story is: don't do it. http://klonglaw.com/?p=403
post #37 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by aundron

Quote:
Originally Posted by enchantedcreations

Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

I also think the article raises some good points, but those points could have been better organized and outlined more succinctly. For example, the issues of fan art and parody probably should have been covered in a few sentences instead of several paragraphs.



Well, you know what they say about hindsight.....

I would also like to point out: If you are running a legal bakery, be it a store front or home front and you feel you ARE legal, then why get on a forum and be so shocked and dismayed over these situations? It should be a non-issue.



Could you elaborate a little more on your last comment please? (shocked and dismayed)

I just meant some people are surprised when they find out they're breaking the law by "copying" Disnsey, Sports" logos, etc. This issue has come up on CC countless times.
Major life events require sugar.
Major life events require sugar.
post #38 of 68
Thread Starter 
[/quote] I just meant some people are surprised when they find out they're breaking the law by "copying" Disnsey, Sports" logos, etc. This issue has come up on CC countless times.[/quote]

Well, I guess the shock for me was this huge corporation coming after my small business, not something I've ever had to deal with. I understand what you are saying, but regardless, it is shocking.

HOWEVER, I did take the picture down from CC and from my website and have discussed it with a lawyer who has told me what to do. AND, I will be taking down some other pics as well. icon_smile.gif
I dream about cakes and stilettos!!
I dream about cakes and stilettos!!
post #39 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by kelleym

I feel the article in question is not a good reference for cake makers because it was not written by a lawyer. Here is an article my attorney wrote on selling cakes made from copyrighted character pans. The moral of the story is: don't do it. http://klonglaw.com/?p=403


I recommend using caution when judging the quality of a work based solely on the profession of the author. Lawyers are capable of writing both good articles and bad articles, as are non-lawyers who have some legal knowledge.

It's interesting to note that the article you linked to (which is a good one) is basically the same thing I posted a month earlier:
http://cakecentral.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=6996838&sid=d4eb2f74732cc2dc0cff54b46bca0a4c
post #40 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by kelleym

I am not seeing where this thread turned ugly...?

I feel the article in question is not a good reference for cake makers because it was not written by a lawyer. Here is an article my attorney wrote on selling cakes made from copyrighted character pans. The moral of the story is: don't do it. http://klonglaw.com/?p=403



Sorry, wrong choice of word.... gatorcake didn't like my post, I possibly offended her. I didn't mean too. But the "perhaps" sound of her post didn't come off to me as "friendly", IMO..........No, I'm not an atty, nor was that blog written by one, so no one should take it as the gospel. However, I think gatorcake and I should agree to disagree, we both read that blog with a different point of view. Which is fine. That's what makes this world go around.

I just asked her to be more opened minded, she didn't think it was necessary based on what she took out of the blog.
Major life events require sugar.
Major life events require sugar.
post #41 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason_kraft

Quote:
Originally Posted by kelleym

I feel the article in question is not a good reference for cake makers because it was not written by a lawyer. Here is an article my attorney wrote on selling cakes made from copyrighted character pans. The moral of the story is: don't do it. http://klonglaw.com/?p=403


I recommend using caution when judging the quality of a work based solely on the profession of the author. Lawyers are capable of writing both good articles and bad articles, as are non-lawyers who have some legal knowledge.

It's interesting to note that the article you linked to (which is a good one) is basically the same thing I posted a month earlier:
http://cakecentral.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=6996838&sid=d4eb2f74732cc2dc0cff54b46bca0a4c


I don't call a plumber when I have a legal problem, and I don't call my lawyer to come fix my toilet when it's broken. (Ironically, they both charge me about the same hourly rate.icon_wink.gif )

It's highly appropriate to judge work by the education and expertise of the creator.
post #42 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by kelleym

It's highly appropriate to judge work by the education and expertise of the creator.


I agree...an article written by someone with education and expertise in the relevant field will typically be a high quality article.

Fortunately you do not have to pass the bar exam to acquire education and expertise in the legal field.
post #43 of 68
I'm not sure I understand all of this (English not being my first language). If I make a cake (for arguments sake) in the shape of Hello Kitty but not out of a Hello Kitty pan is that copyright? or does it only apply if one is using a special shaped pan?
post #44 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claire138

I'm not sure I understand all of this (English not being my first language). If I make a cake (for arguments sake) in the shape of Hello Kitty but not out of a Hello Kitty pan is that copyright? or does it only apply if one is using a special shaped pan?


Hello Kitty is a copyrighted character, so unless you got permission from the copyright owner you would be violating copyright law whether or not you used the Hello Kitty pan to make the cake (even if you don't sell the cake).

If you can't get permission from the copyright owner, the safest thing to do would be to purchase licensed toppers for the cake, since the toppers have already been approved by the copyright owner.

Of course if you are just making a cake for your own family and don't plan on taking any pictures of the cake the risk of getting caught is very low, and some character pans say that they are OK for home use only.
post #45 of 68
Ah, ok. Thanks for your quick response, I've always wondered.
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