Change happens. It's not that people are lazy. It just does. Language is not something that is static and never changing. It drives me crazy when people think there are certain rules that must always be followed. Many times these "rules" are in gray areas and up to interpretation. For example, I think the word "whom" is dead, but people who want to speak "correct English" keep trying to resurrect it. Let it go. It's okay. Most people aren't judging you. (Can you tell I majored in Linguistics?)
When you write a letter to someone, the greeting doesn't read "Dear, Sue," or Dear, Sir:". Just saying.
No, but another option for a proper salutation would be, "Hello, Sue", where the comma is a necessity.
I view the statement, "Happy Birthday, Sue!" as a shortened form of the declaration, "(Have a) Happy Birthday, Sue!), where the comma is necessary & correct.
As for the fluidity of language, yes, it does evolve, but the evolution doesn't suddenly render the previous rules and practices wrong--antiquated, arcane, outdated--but NOT wrong.
To me, the new "rules", present only a new option, not a command to adjust my practices. I'm not about to re-learn English grammar at this point in my life in order to appease the "new linguists".
Just sayin'
Rae
When you write a letter to someone, the greeting doesn't read "Dear, Sue," or Dear, Sir:". Just saying.
But if you start it "Hi, Sue," it does 
It's a direct address in that case, so you put it in. For the birthday cakes that I do I use a comma. I guess I could start writing "Yo, yo, have a good birday fo'shizzle" to be more casual, but I won't do that.
I guess I could start writing "Yo, yo, have a good birday fo'shizzle" to be more casual, but I won't do that.
Would you please do that? I would die. And it's birFday, don't forget! Haha!
I guess I could start writing "Yo, yo, have a good birday fo'shizzle" to be more casual, but I won't do that.
Would you please do that? I would die. And it's birFday, don't forget! Haha!
Oh, of course, I wouldn't want to misspell that!
When you write a letter to someone, the greeting doesn't read "Dear, Sue," or Dear, Sir:". Just saying.
No, but another option for a proper salutation would be, "Hello, Sue", where the comma is a necessity.
I view the statement, "Happy Birthday, Sue!" as a shortened form of the declaration, "(Have a) Happy Birthday, Sue!), where the comma is necessary & correct.
As for the fluidity of language, yes, it does evolve, but the evolution doesn't suddenly render the previous rules and practices wrong--antiquated, arcane, outdated--but NOT wrong.
To me, the new "rules", present only a new option, not a command to adjust my practices. I'm not about to re-learn English grammar at this point in my life in order to appease the "new linguists".
Just sayin'
Rae
LOL. In every post, I've said both ways are acceptable. You're insisting that using the comma is "more correct" and that those who don't could be seen as "deficient." Sorry, but it simply isn't "more correct" to use the comma, and in fact, the "no comma" usage is what's being taught today.
Anyway...as I've said before, both are fine so continue as you will, Rae. 
Well, I guess I'll have to write to Aaron Hamburger, winner of the Rome Prize by the American Academy of Arts and Letters, and tell him that he should edit his blog......
http://aaronhamburger.blogspot.com/2006/09/comma-obsession.html
Not only does he spell it out very clearly, but he directs it to WRITING HAPPY BIRTHDAY ON CAKES.
And, I'll tell the Gregg Reference Manual that they're behind the times, too...
Rule: When addressing someone directly, use commas to set off the person's name or title.
http://highered.mcgraw-hill.com/sites/0073545430/information_center_view0/
You say that it's "being taught both ways" and I'm sorry to hear it. Where the ball has been dropped, I don't know.......but for me, you can't have it "both ways".
Sometimes, something is "more correct", and in this case, I believe that the placement of a comma after "Happy Birthday" is more correct.
If I purchased a cake and found the comma missing, I WOULD think that the decorator had made a mistake and I would ask to have it corrected...and if they argued with me about it, or refused to correct it, I wouldn't accept the cake.
Rae
tracy_doodle, I couldn't tell you majored in linguistics at all. Standard English hasn't changed, and the pronoun whom is still very acceptable. Let's just say... instead of asking, "Who am I talking to?", it is much more grammatically correct to ask, "To whom am I speaking?". Thus, one is not using a preposition to end a sentence. Yes, personal interpretations and societal changes have caused a lax in the use of our language. However, it is not improper to continue to use it correctly provided you have the skills and education to do so. As I always told my students, "You will gain a little more respect if you use the English language correctly."
Well, I guess I'll have to write to Aaron Hamburger, winner of the Rome Prize by the American Academy of Arts and Letters, and tell him that he should edit his blog......
http://aaronhamburger.blogspot.com/2006/09/comma-obsession.html
Not only does he spell it out very clearly, but he directs it to WRITING HAPPY BIRTHDAY ON CAKES.
And, I'll tell the Gregg Reference Manual that they're behind the times, too...
Rule: When addressing someone directly, use commas to set off the person's name or title.
http://highered.mcgraw-hill.com/sites/0073545430/information_center_view0/
Yep, I guess it's time someone informed them. 
Well, I guess I'll have to write to Aaron Hamburger, winner of the Rome Prize by the American Academy of Arts and Letters, and tell him that he should edit his blog......
http://aaronhamburger.blogspot.com/2006/09/comma-obsession.html
And he makes the same mistake of equating a verb-less fragment with a complete sentence containing a verb, plus he assumes the message on the cake is directed to the person having a birthday as opposed to everyone at the party.
And, I'll tell the Gregg Reference Manual that they're behind the times, too...
Rule: When addressing someone directly, use commas to set off the person's name or title.
There's nothing wrong with that rule, it just may or may not apply to this situation.
Again, the message on the cake could be addressing the recipient of the cake with "Happy Birthday", or the entire "Happy Birthday <Name>" message could be directed at the implied plural subject "everyone". The intent of the message will determine whether or not a comma is appropriate, and in this case there is little pragmatic difference between the message with or without the comma, so for all but the most pedantic it's a moot point.
If I purchased a cake and found the comma missing, I WOULD think that the decorator had made a mistake and I would ask to have it corrected...and if they argued with me about it, or refused to correct it, I wouldn't accept the cake.
You know what they say, the customer is always right.
"...he assumes the message on the cake is directed to the person having a birthday as opposed to everyone at the party."
Do you decorate a lot of cakes with Happy Birthday <Name> on them and are directed to "everyone at the party"????
Is there a movement afoot that I haven't heard about where everyone named Sue, with the same birthdate, is invited to huge party and it's
"comma optional"??????????
If the cake is being made for all of the children in the class who celebrate their birthdays in August, then it should read, "Happy Birthday August Babies". No one in in the class is named "August Babies"--I hope--so, of course, no comma.
When I'm asked to make a cake for a birthday, I guess I'm a pedantic fool, but I make it a point to ascertain EXACTLY who it is for---and punctuate accordingly.
"When addressing someone directly, use commas to set off the person's name or title."
There's nothing wrong with that rule, it just may or may not apply to this situation."
Now who's being pedantic???? Of course it applies when someone's given name is being used in the sentiment.
Having fun hunting for zebras tonight?
A client who asks for the correct punctuation is arguing a "moot" point and being "pedantic"......wow.
And a prize winning author and a respected reference book for authors, grammarians, linguists, editors, etc. should take the advice of a few posters on a cake decorating site? Hubris at it's finest.
Rae
And a prize winning author and a respected reference book for authors, grammarians, linguists, editors, etc. should take the advice of a few posters on a cake decorating site? Hubris at it's finest.
Rae
Oh, I'm MUCH more than a poster on a cake decorating site!
I just don't understand why you're SO determined that your way is "more" correct when BOTH ways are accepted - and taught - by grammarians, professors, linguists, etc. Anyway, I'm totally done with this poor horse. You all can continue this silly debate without me.
Anyway, I'm totally done with this poor horse.
haha Agreed!
Do you decorate a lot of cakes with Happy Birthday <Name> on them and are directed to "everyone at the party"????
You misunderstand. People gather to celebrate, say, Grandma's birthday. The message "Happy Birthday Grandma" can indeed be directed at everyone present, since everyone presumably wants to wish Grandma a happy birthday if they are at the party (unless they are just in it for the cake). It's as if the cake said "Everyone, let's say 'Happy Birthday, Grandma'!" (note the comma due to the complete sentence as opposed to a fragment phrase).
A client who asks for the correct punctuation is arguing a "moot" point and being "pedantic"......wow.
Yes, a client who argues about the placement of a comma on a birthday cake is being pedantic.
And a prize winning author and a respected reference book for authors, grammarians, linguists, editors, etc. should take the advice of a few posters on a cake decorating site? Hubris at it's finest.
Appeal to authority fallacy. Do you disagree with my point that the prize-winning author compared a verb-less fragment with a verb-containing sentence? I also did not dispute the rule given by the reference book you mentioned, merely its application to this situation.
Good God, i haven't roared laughing with tears rolling down my cheeks for a while now - this thread has some of the funniest posts i have ever read on this forum....
There are indeed, some very quick witted people amongst us -
PRICELESS.
Back to the topic - never have i seen a comma on a cake. 
Perhaps it is in the delivery of how one says the sentance.
Happy Birthday Blue or Happy Birthday, Blue.
Do people actually pipe/place a *!* on a cake also?
That, i have never seen.
Bluehue.
Good God, i haven't roared laughing with tears rolling down my cheeks for a while now - this thread has some of the funniest posts i have ever read on this forum....
There are indeed, some very quick witted people amongst us -
PRICELESS.
Back to the topic - never have i seen a comma on a cake.
Perhaps it is in the delivery of how one says the sentance.
Happy Birthday Blue or Happy Birthday, Blue.
Do people actually pipe/place a *!* on a cake also?
That, i have never seen.
Bluehue.
Fo shizzle dey puts da xclamashun on da cakes.
I have to agree that this thread is highly amusing but won't change the minds of anyone. Put the stupid comma on or not, who cares? It's a stupid birthday cake, for pete's sake.
I've also wondered who "Pete" is. And no, that wasn't asking for the etymology of the expression, it's just a toss-off comment!
Do people actually pipe/place a *!* on a cake also?
That, i have never seen.
We make a lot of birthday cakes, and most of our orders are via our online order form where customers can spell out the exact message they want on the cake. They include an exclamation point about half the time, and we put the exclamation point on the cake when they request it. In some cases they include 2 or 3 exclamation points.
Customers will rarely include a comma in the message (maybe 5% of the time) -- in those cases we put a comma on the cake, but we never add a comma (or an exclamation point) if the customer doesn't ask for it.
It's too bad Lynne Truss doesn't address the subject of cake inscriptions in her book, Eats, Shoots and Leaves
. (And, BTW, the title should be underlined.)
For those enjoying this, here's another cute story about a cake (about halfway down the page):
http://sentencesleuth.blogspot.com/2009/12/commas-in-nouns-of-address.html
Damn those pedants arguing moot points!!!!!
Yet another pedant irritated by a missing comma in his birthday wish:
http://www.kirkmahoney.com/blog/2008/09/happy-birthday-kirk/
Another pedant mortified that the cake was missing it's comma:
http://blog.robdyoung.com/2011/01/happy-birthday-henry.html
Darn, another English prof who supports wasting icing on commas:
http://forums.about.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?nav=messages&webtag=ab-grammar&tid=612
This one is from a pretty pedant:
http://saybrookmarketing.com/blog/2011/03/when-smart-people-use-bad-grammar/
Why, here's a "grammar doctor" commenting on the comma:
http://www.grammardocs.com/2011/03/the-comma-unloved-and-underused/
Happy Birthday, Cameron Diaz!
Rae
Wow are we in english class or on a cake decorating site? This topic made me laugh.. It's a personal choice use it ,don't use it. I for one have never seen it and think it would look silly on a cake. But that is my personal opinion. Have fun with the cakes and leave the grammer for the english teacher!!!
For those enjoying this, here's another cute story about a cake (about halfway down the page):
http://sentencesleuth.blogspot.com/2009/12/commas-in-nouns-of-address.html
Damn those pedants arguing moot points!!!!!
Yet another pedant irritated by a missing comma in his birthday wish:
http://www.kirkmahoney.com/blog/2008/09/happy-birthday-kirk/
Another pedant mortified that the cake was missing it's comma:
http://blog.robdyoung.com/2011/01/happy-birthday-henry.html
Darn, another English prof who supports wasting icing on commas:
http://forums.about.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?nav=messages&webtag=ab-grammar&tid=612
This one is from a pretty pedant:
http://saybrookmarketing.com/blog/2011/03/when-smart-people-use-bad-grammar/
Why, here's a "grammar doctor" commenting on the comma:
http://www.grammardocs.com/2011/03/the-comma-unloved-and-underused/
Happy Birthday, Cameron Diaz!
Rae
*its comma
Of course, it's a personal choice to use or not use a comma in an inscription, angelleyes. But it is a matter of being grammatically correct. And speaking of such, it's grammAr (unless you're referring to Kelsey and then the g would be capitalized), and the word English is always capitalized.
This topic is crazy! Lots of funny stuff here! I loved your stories, Rea. It especially cracked me up when someone mentioned their college book teaching it one way or the other. Didn't we learn that when we were 8?!
Just for the record, the current curriculum I use for 2nd and 3rd grade still teaches to use the comma. I don't use it on cakes but it's crossed my mind a time or two and I would use it if requested. I think the point, Scarymissmary, is to be open to doing what your costumer wants & what looks and feels best to you.
Before this thread, it never occurred to me not to use a comma when wishing someone a happy birthday.
I write the comma on a cake and I use an exclamation point. I've never thought twice about that. The cake is specifically for the birthday girl/boy's birthday and is an enthusiastic wish for a happy birthday!
After reading this thread, I'll try to assume everyone on Facebook is being grammatically correct when they leave out the comma after wishing their friend a happy birthday.
Thanks for all of the links backing up the old school way! I didn't realize I was so old.
Chasey, we're not old.....we just have more insurance and experience !
This thread is hilarious, comma is correct, most people leave it out, just because something becomes popular in usage does not mean it is now the universal standard, who am I speaking to is never correct, lol, just could not help myself, still laughing. Imagine all this energy going into ending hunger.
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