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Fondant is sagging on my VERY moist cakes. HELP!

post #1 of 29
Thread Starter 
After my cakes sit overnight with fondant over it, the bottom bulges and sags. Of course, by this time, the fondant is dry, so I can't mess with it or it cracks/breaks. I don't know if it's because my cakes are so moist (I use a basic box cake mix with mayo in it right now) or there is another factor. I use Satin Ice fondant. I have tried rolling it thinly (which always gets a tear) and thickly. Luckily, I have been able to coverup the apparent bulge with a border, but I still see it. See my blue/brown baby shower cake. I know the weight of the top tier may have been a factor, but I have also done 1 tier cakes that did the same thing.
My husband swears no one else can tell, but I just want a nice, smooth, nonbulging cake! It's flat and smooth when I first put it on. I also have an issue with my buttercream not crusting (see my other thread) and I don't know if that's an issue. I am using a non high ration shortening (Crisco). Don't know how and where to get a high ratio without paying way more. Any advice? Thanks in advance!

www.tarascupcakes.blogspot.com
post #2 of 29
the crisco may be the problem, now that it has no trans fats, it is causing a lot of BC to not crust and slip and slide.

find a store brand with trans fats and see if it helps

Sharon Zambito

SugarEd Productions Online Sugar Art School 
www.sugaredproductions.com

 

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Sharon Zambito

SugarEd Productions Online Sugar Art School 
www.sugaredproductions.com

 

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post #3 of 29
I think that it is probably your cakes. If the cake isn't firm enough it will compress with the weight of the fondant, which gives you excess fondant that kind of puddles at the bottom.

See if you can find a firmer cake recipe.
post #4 of 29
Is it worse in cakes with more than one tier? Are you putting in the right amount of internal support for your tiered cakes? (ie skewers or straws or SPS).

One idea with moist cakes too is to wrap and freeze them, then when they defrost they seem more stable. Really fresh cakes are difficult to fondant I find!

If you don't want to change your cake recipe or to freeze, you might try wrapping your cake sides in fondant first, then applying fondant to the top...you can pipe over the join or simply smooth over. This might help with the weight of the fondant affecting the cake structure by dragging down on the sides. Or you can wrap the sides, let it dry, then apply another layer of fondant over the whole cake?

Life's too short to make cake pops.
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Life's too short to make cake pops.
___________________________________
www.sweetperfection.com.au

www.sweetperfectioncakes.blogspot.com.au/
www.facebook.com/sweetperfectioncakes (come visit sometime!)

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post #5 of 29
Are you doweling your cakes and letting your fondant sit before you stack them? Its best to cover the night before you decorate so the fondant has a chance to firm up. you then dowel and stack.

Thats how I do it anyway.

It does sound like your cakes are too soft also, are you using anything underneath the fondant? If you ganache the ganache should be set and if you buttercream it should be refrigerated so its hard. It will soften up after its covered.

I looked at your fondant and it looks really wet, what do you use to roll it out?
post #6 of 29
It seems like lots of people are having saggy cakes this weekend!1 I did and I was using satin ice!! icon_sad.gif Still don't know why.
post #7 of 29
I have a very soft cake that I cover in fondant. If you think the weight of your top tier is too heavy, you may need a better support system. The weight of cakes shouldn't effect being on top of each other if they are supported properly.
post #8 of 29
After you torte and fill your cakes how long do you let them sit before covering with fondant?

I find it essential to let them sit at room temp at least for half a day, but usually overnight. The weight of the layers compresses the filling and allows air to escape. It also allows excess filling to smoosh out. I even put a heavy chopping board, bought and used only for this purpose, on top of the cake to really compress everything. The next day I can just go over the cake with a spatula, clean up any filling that has bulged out and then crumbcoat and cover. If you cover with fondant without letting the cake stand the air or filling gets trapped in the fondant creating a bulge.

I also find it easier to cover the cake with ganache under fondant. It sets up hard and really holds in the filling, preventing bulges and bumps.
Formerly The Casual Kitchen. Just here for cake
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Formerly The Casual Kitchen. Just here for cake
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post #9 of 29
Thread Starter 
I do use dowels for support. Currently I'm only doing a 6" on a 8" so I use 3 dowels for the support. I usually freeze or chill them very cold, ice with my non-crusting buttercream (another issue I'm having), refrigerate for the night, then the next day I lay the fondant over and start putting all the fondant embellishments on it, which I'm sure add more weight. I will try letting it harden first before decorating. That's one thing.
Next, I will search for a shortening that has trans fat. I assume it will say somewhere on the can?
Oh and recently I found out that I should not be refrigerating my fondant cakes. That's why most of them look wet. I have not done it the last 2 fondant cakes and they were fine. They didn't melt after I took them out. Silly me. I'm self-teaching myself, so I'm learning everything the hard way.
I think my first step is to get a crusting buttercream.
Somewhere I read to fondant a room-temp cake cause if not, when the cold cake/icing warms, it will have condensation and if the fondant is on it, it will ruin the fondant. But on this site, it seems as though everyone fondants a cold cake. I even read a thread somewhere from Collette Peters and she fondants a cold cake as well. I'm gonna try that as well.
Keep the ideas coming and I really and truly appreciate your help! It means everything to me!
post #10 of 29
I use IMBC and that does not crust. I also do not keep my cakes in the fridge over night. I keep them in there long enough to get firm & I don't always do that. The wedding cake in my pics was never in the fridge & is covered in fondant. That is probably your problem. They are to cold underneath and are settling as they warm back up. And keep in mind what works for some does not work for others.
post #11 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaBellaFlor

I use IMBC and that does not crust. I also do not keep my cakes in the fridge over night. I keep them in there long enough to get firm & I don't always do that. The wedding cake in my pics was never in the fridge & is covered in fondant. That is probably your problem. They are to cold underneath and are settling as they warm back up. And keep in mind what works for some does not work for others.




It's all so very confusing. I read another cake maker who says she freezes a cake covered in fondant!!??!! I don't know what to try this weekend. I DON'T want my fondant to do that darn bulging thing at the bottom.
I'm nervous!
I guess I'll just put the fondant on a room-temp, iced cake and let it settle overnight at room temp and then decorate the next day. Seems like a lot of waiting and also makes the cake older too. Not as fresh. Anyway....
post #12 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KitchenKat

After you torte and fill your cakes how long do you let them sit before covering with fondant?

I find it essential to let them sit at room temp at least for half a day, but usually overnight. The weight of the layers compresses the filling and allows air to escape. It also allows excess filling to smoosh out. I even put a heavy chopping board, bought and used only for this purpose, on top of the cake to really compress everything. The next day I can just go over the cake with a spatula, clean up any filling that has bulged out and then crumbcoat and cover. If you cover with fondant without letting the cake stand the air or filling gets trapped in the fondant creating a bulge.

I also find it easier to cover the cake with ganache under fondant. It sets up hard and really holds in the filling, preventing bulges and bumps.



I'm going to try this today with the compression. What do you do about using the ganache if the customer does not want chocolate? Plus, that will add to my cost, which I can't do right now, but maybe some day. Thanks for the tip!
post #13 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tarascupcakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by KitchenKat

After you torte and fill your cakes how long do you let them sit before covering with fondant?

I find it essential to let them sit at room temp at least for half a day, but usually overnight. The weight of the layers compresses the filling and allows air to escape. It also allows excess filling to smoosh out. I even put a heavy chopping board, bought and used only for this purpose, on top of the cake to really compress everything. The next day I can just go over the cake with a spatula, clean up any filling that has bulged out and then crumbcoat and cover. If you cover with fondant without letting the cake stand the air or filling gets trapped in the fondant creating a bulge.

I also find it easier to cover the cake with ganache under fondant. It sets up hard and really holds in the filling, preventing bulges and bumps.



I'm going to try this today with the compression. What do you do about using the ganache if the customer does not want chocolate? Plus, that will add to my cost, which I can't do right now, but maybe some day. Thanks for the tip!



Also, I don't think my cake would hold a heavy board on top of it. I think it would break. I may have to try something. Hopefully the crusting recipe that everyone swears by that I'm going to try today will help the situation as well. IDK!
post #14 of 29
I would suggest trying a different cake. Here's a link to some AWESOME variations of WASC. It's a sturdy, but moist cake, can be used under fondant & carved as well. http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=df4f9hbq_46cs9f28fs

Here's what works for me.

1) A thick dam---prevents that middle bulge. From Sugarshack I learned to mix in PS until thick (I like to be able to form a ball out of it)

2) After I pipe the dam I put a piece of wax paper on top of it, then a cake board & press down gently but firmly. I fill then put on top cake layer. I do the same w/ the wax paper/board again.

3) Crumb coat & let sit at least a few hours or overnight. If I don't have time for this I will sit a pan or board on top of the cake w/ a jar or can (not empty) to help w/ compression.

4) I don't usually put a lot of buttercream on the cake but will put a little more if I think it needs it. Smooth w/ Viva papertowel & pop in deep freezer for about 10 min. This hardens the buttercream, but not the cake. Done it w/ SMBC too.

5) Cover in fondant & let sit a few hours before decorating.

Is your dam firm? How much buttercream do you put on? The weight of the fondant may be squishing the buttercream when it warms up. Again try another cake recipe! I agree w/ the cakes being too cold. Also, you can freeze MMF, but it needs to be put in the fridge to thaw before room temp. You can put it straight into the fridge & then room temp w/ no problem. Another thing, once you've crumb coated you've sealed in the moisture & it will be ok at room temp about 5-7 days. Fillings are another story

Hope you're getting answers to your question!
Friends will enhance your life. Everyone else is just an acquaintance
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Friends will enhance your life. Everyone else is just an acquaintance
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post #15 of 29
For your buttercream issue, try Wal-Mart's Great Value Vegetable Shortening (make sure you get veg as both the veg and the meat fats have a picture of pie!). I switched a few cakes back and have loved my buttercream ever since.

As for Satin Ice, I always seem to get little tears here and there, so I can't help you with that!
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