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post #46 of 70
Thread Starter 
Well put, Beebug123!!! (To enter or not enter because you think you may or may not win is cheating yourself out this chance and this challenge!)

I think having 20 posts is a good idea, like it or not! Maybe it's just me, but I can't see why anyone would be afraid to post, even if it's just a "Good job" after someone posted a pic or "what a great idea." There's no way to ever make any contest full-proof, even the olympics. That's just life. I think some of you are just blowing this way out of porportion(sp) icon_confused.gif

Thanks to Jackie for dealing with all of us and giving us a place to share, learn and grow!
My drug of choice is FROSTING!
My drug of choice is FROSTING!
post #47 of 70
So I went To bed last night thinking about this. And I have come to The conclusion that all of this really boils down to pettiness. Here is what I liken this mess to.

A person moves in to a new neighbourhood. The established folks in that neighbourhood host regular social events like pie making contest. The new neighbour decides to enter the contest but The established neighbours say. "Oh no dear, you have not lived here long enough to be allowed to enter our contest. You are not a member of the elite yet."

Whoa, way to make the new neighbour feel welcomed. I personally think that every member of Cake Central should be allowed to participate regardless of how much or how little they post. Like I said everyone participates in their own little way to make this site a success. Not everyone likes to be in the spotlight. Some prefer to work behind the scenes.


Exclusion is always a great way to make others feel welcome and a part of the group. It will sure encourage non-posters to post to the forums.


Well I have Said all I will say regarding this topic. I hope that this matter is resolved in a way that's fair to all members of this site.


Princess
The 6 Ps Law states Proper Preparation Prevents Pi$$ Poor Performance.

-Mr. Morganti
The 6 Ps Law states Proper Preparation Prevents Pi$$ Poor Performance.

-Mr. Morganti
post #48 of 70
Hello everyone, I just found out about this site a couple of months ago and I have to agree with everyone that I think it would be fair to at least limit entries to those who share and posts regularly. I have not felt comfortable sharing info because I feel like such a newbie...I've only had one course and have dealt with only buttercream icing and royal icing. I'm learning more techniques and appreciate all the assistance and recommendations given in the forum. I read a lot and am just now starting to post. As a matter of fact, this is my fourth, I believe.

Lisa
Lisa G. Morales
Lisa G. Morales
post #49 of 70
Haha, well I am not certain if I am one of those people that are "Blowing it out of proportion", or not, but that is not my intention. I don't see this as a fight, I see it as a discussion. And I fully appreciate that everyone has a right to express the way they feel about things as that is where the topic was heading and that is what Jackie was asking for.
It is not my decision, that is true and I do have an opinion that is also true.
I am worried that this might all end up making things a bit on the mean-spirited side. Sometimes these kinds of discussions have that effect.
This has happened several times on this site already, though maybe not as often as it happens on some other sites, that is true.
I like to look at all aspects of a discussion or an issue and consider the effects on all of the people involved. I must say when I read this post and others that I was concerned that the lady that actually won this competition, would feel badly if she was to read the references to her in all of this. I would have been hurt myself. It was like it was being said that she did not deserve to win because she doesn't post here. It was also stated in another post that she would likely never offer any help to others that might want to learn how to do a cake like hers. That bothered me, it may be true and it may well be not true but it isn't a nice thing to say or assume. And the statement being made would make me think twice about ever posting if I was in her shoes.
I understand why it was said, because folks felt the winner should be a regular. But this lady entered the contest according to the rules as they were stated. I don't like the way members rate some cakes incredibly low or only rate the cake they want to win, ignoring most or all of the others, but then again, they are following the rules as stated, so I can dislike this. I can even protest it by not voting, but I cannot say they did not follow rules.
I find that new members sometimes have a rough time on sites. Sometimes they get jumped on for every bit of advice they offer, like some folks are just waiting for them to make what they feel is a mistake. It is almost like they haven't earned the privilege to even post or have an opinion. I know personally that has happened to me, even on this site. I know new members sometimes get ignored on sites too.
Gosh sometimes you feel like you have to have your own gang there supporting you, just like a gang of highschool girls.
The end result is you lose members over things like that, they don't want to be attacked or criticized or be subjected to pettiness, so they just leave. Well, when they leave we all suffer a bit.
Then things quiet down for awhile, then folks start posting again, then it all starts over again. Unfortunately, that is the reason that sites have to have moderators.
People have different reasons for participating in contests, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with any of the reasons they may have.
I think that we have to be careful and exercise good judgement in how we react to things. I will give an example. Take the July 4th Cake Contest. Now it likely never dawned on a lot of folks that July 4th is strictly an American celebration and really a contest for a cake to celebrate this day, excludes anyone not of American descent. I know that a lot of Americans assume it is a holiday everywhere, I know this because many know I am a Canadian and still ask me what I do for July 4th. Every country has their own national holidays just as every religions has its own celebrations. So what would happen if say a Canadian or European or... entered the contest? Would it offend folks because they were not of the right nationality? What about Christmas cake contests, would it offend folks if a non-Christian submitted a cake?
Would you be offended as an American if I said I was excluded from the contest because I celebrate July 1st as Canada Day but not July 4th because I am not American. Should I even have the right to vote on the cakes submitted? What would happen if I entered a Canadian flag cake into the contest? But common sense dictates to me that this is an American site and it is owned by an American so of course a 4th of July Cake Contest would be a good concept and since it is her site, she doesn't need to consider how other nationalities may or may not feel left out. Personally I admire the way that Americans show their patriotism, it is a good example for the rest of us and I enjoy looking at the cakes.
I think that exclusion can be a dangerous thing just as lack of tolerance and understanding can cause issues.
Having a minimum posts rule that is posted before a contest begins, will eliminate any further issues like this one, that is true. And if that is what Jackie wants to do and what the majority want, then that will be the rules folks have to follow.
Hugs Squirrelly Cakes
post #50 of 70
Ok guys i was thinking about this also, i was a bit rude i think in another post about this subject. Then as i sat an thought about it i relized for the mothers day contest i only voted for a few cakes thati liked. for the fathers day contest i voted for every single cake. EVERY CAKE which means i voted for the winner. and to be honest i gave her cake a 5 star mostly because it was a great cake and my hubby loves to golf and he loved it. Now with that said i also gave 5 stars to a few others. Now think about it we as members of this site vote on the cakes. SO we as members voted for her cake to win. Maybe not all of us but enough of us did. It wasnt until this was posted that i even went back to see who made the cake and saw she had not posted on the forums. Yes it does upset me but, she does post her cakes so in a way isnt that sharing ideas???? so i am sorry for my other post i didnt mean to offend anyone
post #51 of 70
Ok, I got to thinking about this topic, and reading all of your well thought out responses and I agree that I do not want to exclude people based on forum activity. I do want to have some method of safeguarding against people who join only to enter contests or to give their vote to someone in a contest.

I was thinking of creating a probationary period at the start of membership. For example when you signup you cannot compete in, or vote on, any contest for the first 30 days. This way it would take alot of forsight for someone to "cheat" the system. In this way no members are punished for lack of posting but we protect the integrity of the contests.

As for the voting method, I cannot reasonably implement a system that forces everyone to vote for all the cakes entered, and based on the scoring results I am seeing, this has not been the problem that it is perceived to be. All of the cakes are getting alot of votes, and the scoring has been very close. We do not have a situation of a small group of cakes running away with the contests.

For those of you who think that protesting the system by choosing not to vote is helping improve the community, I have to disagree. By withholding your votes you only increase the impact of everyone elses vote. If your reason for not voting is because you don't believe in contests, that is fine, don't vote, but if you just have a problem with how others are voting, you are solving nothing by standing aside.

Finally please everyone remember these contests are supposed to be fun, don't take the results so seriously. I mean the prize is hardly worth the effort it would take to cheat the system. Please give me your feedback on the probation status idea. I am trying to find the solution that is fair to everyone, excludes no one, and protects the integrity of the community.

I want to thank everyone for taking the time to respond to this thread, all of you have been extremely helpful. icon_biggrin.gif

One more thing I wanted to touch on:
Quote:
Originally Posted by SquirellyCakes

European or... entered the contest? Would it offend folks because they were not of the right nationality? What about Christmas cake contests, would it offend folks if a non-Christian submitted a cake?
Would you be offended as an American if I said I was excluded from the contest because I celebrate July 1st as Canada Day but not July 4th because I am not American. Should I even have the right to vote on the cakes submitted? What would happen if I entered a Canadian flag cake into the contest?



These are excellent points and I am glad SquirellyCakes brought them up. During the holidays, the annual contest is a "Holiday" cake contest, and the rules state it must be in the theme of the holidays, whether its a generic "winter" theme, kwanzaa, channakka (spelling?) or any other religeous/national/cultural theme that celebrates the season.

Yes, I am an American, and the 4th of July contest is mostly based on the American Independence day, however the main theme for the contest is patriotism. If someone wanted to enter a Canada Day flag, or a Mexican, or Israeli flag, or any country for that matter to show pride in thier country, this would be perfectly acceptable. The main them has to be "patriotism" I do not think I made a very good job of explaining this in the rules, and I will create a better description for future contests. These contests were never meant to be as esoteric as they are perceived.

Being an American, I am biased toward using American holidays as contest themes, this was not meant to alienate anyone, it was simply the easiest and most obvious way for me to go. But I have loads of ideas for future contests from the community, and remember to keep those ideas flowing and share them with me. If you are particularly shy, and do not want to make a public post, you can always Private Message me or one of the moderators with your idea.

birthday.gif Jackie

birthday.gif Jackie

post #52 of 70
Thank you, Jackie! The probationary period sounds like a good resolution for the contest entries and voting!

The first contest that I voted in, Mother's Day, I only voted for the ones that I really liked. Later, it was suggested that each one should get a vote and after thinking that over, I agreed! Everybody who goes to the work and thought involved to bake and enter a cake deserves the votes! May I also say that voting for the July 4th contest is going to be really tough, they are all beautiful!

As far as the holidays and cake occasions go, I would guess that the majority of us are in the USA and it is pretty natural to go with those holidays we regularly celebrate!

Again, thanks Jackie! Janice
post #53 of 70
i think the probation is a great idea. and just to point something out. i went back and looked at a bunch of the pictures of people who dont post in the forums and notice they had answered questions that people posted with the pics. So i would like to apologize just because they arent posting in the forums for what ever reason they are still giving help and explaining how they did some of thier cakes its just in the galleries with the pics. Jackie i think maybe we could do a Cinco De Mayo contest next year. Maybe in a month that their isnt a holiday per say we could have a celebration cake contest. which could cover anything we feel like celebrating. this would allow for a wider range in the cakes being submited. just a few ideas what do you think?
post #54 of 70
Actually, I did find the Mother's Day contest did show quite a disparency in the number of votes cast. Some cakes barely were looked at or viewed. Many were marked quite low, I noted this from the beginning of the contest. These two factors influenced how I felt about voting. It was my first personal experience with the contests on this site. No question that the winning cake deserved to win at all, just that the other cakes deserved more attention by the members.
If you go back and read my comments about the 4th of July contest they were, I think, taken out of context. I used it as an example of how far things can be interpreted regarding perceived exclusion and being reasonable and tolerant. It was not an anti-American remark or a criticism, it was using an example of how things can be perceived or misinterpreted. Looking back and reading and re-reading my comments, I was very clear on that.
I personally found the comments directed at the winner, upsetting. I still find them upsetting.
Hugs Squirrelly Cakes
post #55 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by SquirrellyCakes

Actually, I did find the Mother's Day contest did show quite a disparency in the number of votes cast. Some cakes barely were looked at or viewed.



There is no way to view the votes cast on contest entries. These are recorded and kept private. Once the contest is finished it may show an "average" rating or number of times viewed, however neither of these numbers should be looked at seriously. Its actually something I have intended to have disappear entirely, I just have not had the time to remove it yet. As it requires a great deal of programming to remove and I did not want to interfere with the current contest.

During a contest, all of the ratings are summed for each contest entry, for example if a cake received 3 votes that were 5 stars, this cake would have gotten a score of "15". That is how the winning cake has been decided, as the one with the highest score. I haven't had any ties, however it has been extremely close, and I wouldn't be surprised if that happened.

These numbers are never published and are not used in the final "average" score. And the "number of views" is also extremely unreliable, and is something that will be completely gone once the 4th of July contest is finished.

I sincerely hope this has not impeded anyone's ability to vote fairly, or kept them from entering in the contests.

birthday.gif Jackie

birthday.gif Jackie

post #56 of 70
just wondering what will you do if there is ever a tie???
post #57 of 70
Well then, I suppose I will be giving out the same prize to 2 winners icon_smile.gif

birthday.gif Jackie

birthday.gif Jackie

post #58 of 70
lol or maybe you could extend voting just between the two. have like a sudden death voting. lol i guess you can worry about it when it happens.
post #59 of 70
There is no reason why anyone shouldnt enter his or her cakes. Into a contest regardless of skill level everyone should give it a try. I have only been decorating for a short time I truly only have about 6-8 decorated cakes to my name and I have never taken a course. Look at entering the contests this way, if you win congratulations on a job well done if you dont win you still did a good job and chances are that there will be positive feedback on your cake, and that should at least inspire you to want to try again. Remember we are all our own worst critic. The contest is a way to show off your creativity and let the other members of the forum get a good look at what you are capable of. Dont feel your cakes are inferior to anyone elses on here. Everyone is a great decorator and should be proud of what they can do. This is a forum where we all come to share what we can do and help each other by asking and sharing questions tips hints ect.
The idea of creating a minimum requirement to enter a contest is to prevent those from coming to the forum just to compete. Jackies probationary period is a great idea. No matter how the 4th of July contest turns out I think all of the Entrants are winners just for being brave enough to compete.
Alan

If you must run away do so quietly, Screaming looks bad on the news. (unknown)
Alan

If you must run away do so quietly, Screaming looks bad on the news. (unknown)
post #60 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlvmorales

I have not felt comfortable sharing info because I feel like such a newbie...I've only had one course and have dealt with only buttercream icing and royal icing. As a matter of fact, this is my fourth, I believe.
Lisa



Your cakes are wonderful! I can't see why you would think "like a newbie" to me those cakes are not newbie! I hope this means more posts from you! Looks like you could really contribute!
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